Joined: Sun Mar 29, 2009 3:42 am Posts: 218 Location: Bielefeld, Germany
I’d like some feedback on this hand:
NL10 at Stars. 8 players to the hand. 2 loose-passive fish at the table, the other Vs are rather tight. Hero has been lagging it up a bit (VPIP 23, PFR 20, CO 10, 120 hands into the session), V in this hand is a somewhat nitty ABC TAG player (VPIP 10, PFR 10, 3BET 12.5, CO 0). His high 3bet score results from raising the weaker players’ opening bets rather wide. Haven’t seen him play anything but decent hands against the tighter players.
Hero is UTG+1 and finds two red fives. He has 140 BB behind. The fish are on the button and SB, BB is tight. Hero opens for 3BB (his standard bet from EP). V (UTG +2, 78 BB behind) makes it 9 BB. Folded to Hero who calls. There’s now 19.5 BB in the pot.
Flop is 3c4c5c. Hero checks with the intention of reraising V’s likely c-bet (V has been c-betting 100% of the time). According to plan, V c-bets 14BB, leaving him with another 55 BB behind.
Hero? Comments on all streets are welcome.
_________________ If you go from $100 to $2k in 4 days you are doing it wrong. - TheJacob
I think this is an automatic shove here. You are almost certainly ahead, and have decent outs if he had the flush. Shove might be called with AA that has the Ace club. If he doesn't have the ace club, you won't get action if another club hits. It is such a scary flop, just shove and let him make the tough decision. A shove is only a pot sized raise anyways with the effective stacks.
Joined: Mon Jul 10, 2006 11:16 am Posts: 3919 Location: Manassas, VA
As played I agree to shove
Not sure I like preflop. If folks have been raising and 3betting wide then u r investing too much OOP to set mine. I prob just fold pre. I might limp if normal action includes several callers.
_________________ - pls excuse my typos... I'm prob on my iPhone
Joined: Sun Mar 29, 2009 3:42 am Posts: 218 Location: Bielefeld, Germany
Hero shoved, V took his time but finally called with QxQc. Hero's hand holds up. Obviously, I'm fine with the result , but when I showed down my set of fives 2 players (including V) berated me for calling the 3bet with a low pair. I didn't respond but they got me thinking.
My reasoning at the time was that this V wouldn't 3bet from EP with less than a big pair or AK. In that case I was pretty sure that, like most players at this level, he was probably willing to go broke on all but the most dangerous boards if I made my set. I had to call 6 BB to close the preflop action with V having 69BB behind, so 1-2.25 straight pot-odds and an additional 1-11.5 in implied odds.
Is that too marginal for a call? I call smallish preflop 3bets with small pairs pretty often (unless stacks are clearly to shallow). The typical scenario is I open-raise a small pair from LP for 3 BB, BB comes over the top for 9+ BB with effective stacks of about 100BB. In this situation I will often call the 9/10 BB 3bets (for another 6 or 7BB) as I'm getting good implied odds AND position. To 11+BB 3bets I will fold as I can't win enough on average to make a call worthwhile. Where do you guys draw the line?
Numerius
_________________ If you go from $100 to $2k in 4 days you are doing it wrong. - TheJacob
Hero shoved, V took his time but finally called with QxQc. Hero's hand holds up. Obviously, I'm fine with the result , but when I showed down my set of fives 2 players (including V) berated me for calling the 3bet with a low pair. I didn't respond but they got me thinking.
My reasoning at the time was that this V wouldn't 3bet from EP with less than a big pair or AK. In that case I was pretty sure that, like most players at this level, he was probably willing to go broke on all but the most dangerous boards if I made my set. I had to call 6 BB to close the preflop action with V having 69BB behind, so 1-2.25 straight pot-odds and an additional 1-11.5 in implied odds.
Is that too marginal for a call? I call smallish preflop 3bets with small pairs pretty often (unless stacks are clearly to shallow). The typical scenario is I open-raise a small pair from LP for 3 BB, BB comes over the top for 9+ BB with effective stacks of about 100BB. In this situation I will often call the 9/10 BB 3bets (for another 6 or 7BB) as I'm getting good implied odds AND position. To 11+BB 3bets I will fold as I can't win enough on average to make a call worthwhile. Where do you guys draw the line?
Numerius
It is a marginal call. I would have folded to the reraise. You have to call 6bb to potentially win 69bb which is what was remaining in Vs stack. I prefer to have 15-20x the call or more.
The pot has 13.5bb in it and it costs you 6bb to call....getting a little over 2-1 pot odds. With flopping a set is 7.5-1 against, you need to win pretty much his whole stack to make it a profitable call. So to call here you have to have a good read on the V.....can he 1) only reraise with a big pair and not AK, and 2) stack off with the big pair to 3 undercards.
Late to the discussion here (so much so that some lunatic got involved). Here's my two cents:
I have no problem with check raising all in. However, I might opt to check call and shove any non-club turn card. This option might reduce variance a bit. I'll feel sick if a club comes on the turn and, in these cases, will appreciate not having my whole stack already in the pot. This move is better is position (which we are not here) and better against more ABC opponents (against a LAG this might open up too much room for him to steal the pot if a scare card comes on the turn...). Against a tricky LAG, I might lean more toward the CRAI.
In reality, we should not fear a straight here a whole lot. Villain is not likely to have 3-bet pre-flop with low cards (although I suppose something like 7-7 is in his range and gives him a draw). What will really cause the bag holding our family jewels to shrivel up is a fourth club. So, I show of ANY non club that does not pair the board. If the board pairs, I think about a half pot bet to charge the drawing-dead flush draws.
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, but when I showed down my set of fives 2 players (including V) berated me for calling the 3bet with a low pair. I didn't respond but they got me thinking.